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PostPosted: Tue Jun 15, 2010 4:20 am 
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Hey Barry,

Chucks right about being at your temp limit. What you posted (76C ..etc) is where you want to when the cpu is around 3.8 - 4.0 ghz and 100% load. (Actually, the lower the better). It can be acheived with good cooling for the cpu. You should be able to get higher speeds and bclk's (base clock) with a good after market cpu cooler. I've been looking at the Corsair H50 cpu water cooler for approx $85 from TigerDirect.ca, for my build. Or you can opt for a good air cooler such as the Cooler Master V8 (this thing is quite large so if space in your case is an issue go for the H50 or a smaller air cooler). You could have Tiger Direct Techs install either one for you or if your up for the challenge, check out some Youtube instructional videos on how to install them. There are some good ones out there. What attracted me to the H50 is that it is a self contained system so there is no maintenance involved, just install it and Overclock (carefully of course). Also check out the link to Overclockers.com where there is a good 3 step explanation on how to OC a i3, i5 or i7 cpu and memory. This will give you a better idea on whether or not to tackle something like this.

http://www.overclockers.com/3-step-guide-overclock-core-i3-i5-i7

Please keep in mind that I haven't done this yet. I'm still in the midst of getting a new FSX system together. The info above is what I have learned in the last few weeks reading up on a number of forums in the tech world. Hopefully my comments will give you more insight on improving your system to where your happy with it.

Cheers,
Dave CVA1019 :)



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PostPosted: Tue Jun 15, 2010 12:20 pm 
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Well the first thing I have to do is get a handle on the CPU temps. It turns out the fan on the stock cooler is not working, hence the 70C plus temps. My big case and its fans are saving me now, but I need a cooler for the CPU (i7-920). David, that CM V8 is looking good to me. I have the room for it and I think I'll stay away from water for now - but good luck with that C-H50!

Once done (cooling), I'll look into getting the CPU OC'd to somewhere over 3.0. I'm getting good performance and graphics now at 2.7-2.8 when flying. But I got tons of add-ons and I love eye candy so I want a boost. Things can still slow down a bit at the big airports or in heavy weather.

I'll be reporting back on my progress. And thanks everyone for the great advice! - as always from the CVA network.



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PostPosted: Tue Jun 15, 2010 5:33 pm 
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Hey Guys,

Chuck my computer's CPU is an Intel® Pentium 4 CPU 2.50GHz 1.50GB of RAM.

Windows Xp(2002 edition) Service pack 3

Am I able to overclock this CPU of mine?

I tried downloading RealTemp and using it but it says it does not support my CPU type.

-Matt



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PostPosted: Tue Jun 15, 2010 8:13 pm 
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Matt, overclocking that thing won't give you noticeable improvements. I'd keep that as a network PC to run the intrument and auxilliary stuff like ServInfo, FSinn, PDF browser, etc. And then get a new gamer.

Don't forget, old PCs "usually" overclock by small percentages, 10-20% was a huge leap. Liquid cooling was the way to get some major jump, and even that was maybe 30-40% on average?

Today's CPUs can move up a LOT higher, and air coolers have gotten way better too. Of course all things are relative, sometimes you get a new unit that is close to max, or are lucky to have an old unit that can overclock like crazy.

But I wouldn't push that old P4, I'm keeping mine as a support PC on my network for a reason. Don't forget, you only have one core, so everything runs at the same place as FS-X, that means even more load.



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PostPosted: Tue Jun 15, 2010 9:02 pm 
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Good point Robert, im just torn between the idea of building my own PC, upgrading my current one, or just buying one, the cost to make one seems a slight more expensive, but the parts you put into it are regulated and of good quality, however I might just end up buying a pre-made computer, i'll have to do my research.

Also would you guys recommend buying a 2.5-2.9GHz CPU then overclock it or rather spend the extra money to buy a better CPU with maybe 3+ GHz?

-Matt




Edited By mattymsboi on 1276635785



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PostPosted: Tue Jun 15, 2010 10:43 pm 
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mattymsboi wrote:
Also would you guys recommend buying a 2.5-2.9GHz CPU then overclock it or rather spend the extra money to buy a better CPU with maybe 3+ GHz?

Good question.

And why is that AMD seems to have 3.4 or more on all their CPUs and Intel has 2.6 or so? Aren't they measuring the same thing?

AMD Phenom II quad

Intel core 2 quad

Why don't I look for an AMD?!?!?! :oops:




Edited By Rob Vanderkam on 1276642212



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PostPosted: Wed Jun 16, 2010 2:50 am 
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Matt and Rob,

If you're looking for an already built computer, I suggest checking out ETC Computers online. They have been the most reasonable priced PC builders i have found in the Toronto area. BTW, they will ship it to you if your not in the GTA as well. You can have them custom build for you to you specs and they will even OC it to 3.6 - 3.8 GHz depend on the hardware you buy, at no extra cost. Sounded like a fair deal to me. Nevertheless, check it out for yourself and you decide. They sell on Ebay as well, you can read some of the comments to see past customer experiences.

Here's the link.

http://www.etccomputer.ca/eShop/default.asp

Hope this whom ever may be looking to upgrade.

Dave cva1019 :thumbsup:



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PostPosted: Wed Jun 16, 2010 5:22 am 
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mattymsboi wrote:
Good point Robert, im just torn between the idea of building my own PC, upgrading my current one, or just buying one, the cost to make one seems a slight more expensive, but the parts you put into it are regulated and of good quality, however I might just end up buying a pre-made computer, i'll have to do my research.

Also would you guys recommend buying a 2.5-2.9GHz CPU then overclock it or rather spend the extra money to buy a better CPU with maybe 3+ GHz?

-Matt

Matt,

If a company-made PC is cheaper than what you can build yourself using equivalent parts, they HAVE to be cutting corners somewhere.

When you build yourself, you cut out the profit someone else is making. You cannot get a cheaper equivalent PC than this way.

I highly recommend you take the plunge and build your own PC. The longer you wait, the more you leave yourself at the mercy of manufacturers. Take the dive now, be ready to accept a mistake that could mean buying one of the parts over again.

Put it this way, there is only one part that you can screw up, it's the CPU, everything else is basically bulletproof. So at worst that is the price of your education. And there isn't a lot of ways to kill a CPU:

- electrostatic discharge (get those $5 gloves).
- bend a pin (I've straightened one before with no problem).
- misplaced heatsink (I did that, one corner of the CPU flew off but I was in a rush that one time, otherwise they are simple to install).
- overclocking too far, like in 100% jumps (go by 10% increments, reduce when it becomes unstable, that's all there is to it).

How much profit do you think those companies are making off you? I'd bet you still break even after you toast 1 chip, but you'll be free to build whatever you want from that day forward.

Chosing the CPU range is a crap shoot. This is how Intel and AMD works:

- they make all CPUs using one set of dies.
- they test CPUs in batches.
- they start the test cycle at their highest frequency (let's say 3.5GHz).
- they lower the frequency by increments (let's say 0.2GHz) until all units in the batch passes.
- the entire batch is labelled as that final passing frequency (sometimes it's right at the first pass when you get a great batch).

So, you can have a CPU in a batch that is officially rated as 2.5GHz but had passed the testing phase at 3.5GHz. You just bought a 3.5GHz CPU at the price of a 2.5GHz, this is what a lot of people gamble on.

In the end, it's your budget that decides. For FS-X, since we know the CPU is the critical component, I'd get the highest rated CPU I could afford, then build around that. I don't gamble, I get the highest I can afford and then see how far I can bump it up.

I do not recommend buying less that a quad core, anything less and you are buying extremely outdated technology. Don't forget, you might get other software that will thrive on a multi-core processor (like maybe Windows 7). So even if FS-X doesn't get the most out of a quad, your OS will run smoother, and hence leave even more room for FS-X.




Edited By CVA0014 on 1276666090



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PostPosted: Wed Jun 16, 2010 3:53 pm 
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Ok, I was looking at CPU's and I found this i5 quad core, its only 2.66 GHz but its at a decent price and I could possibly overclock it as well.
i5 Quad-Core 2.66GHz

I find with the new i3,5 and 7, it doesn't show (pardon my inexperience) information for the speed of RAM I need to use with it, like 1333 MHz or 1600 MHz for example. I need that information so I can pair up the CPU with proper RAM and motherboard correct?

And also how important is the motherboard? Is it something I should spend alot of money on or will a $80-100 one do the job?

-Matt




Edited By mattymsboi on 1276703683



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PostPosted: Wed Jun 16, 2010 4:52 pm 
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mattymsboi wrote:
Ok, I was looking at CPU's and I found this i5 quad core, its only 2.66 GHz but its at a decent price and I could possibly overclock it as well.
i5 Quad-Core 2.66GHz

I find with the new i3,5 and 7, it doesn't show (pardon my inexperience) information for the speed of RAM I need to use with it, like 1333 MHz or 1600 MHz for example. I need that information so I can pair up the CPU with proper RAM and motherboard correct?

And also how important is the motherboard? Is it something I should spend alot of money on or will a $80-100 one do the job?

-Matt

Hi Matt,

The motherboard design will determine the sped of the memory you will need.

Re: cheap motherboard - All I will say is "you get what you pay for" - most of the time. Sometimes you will by a low end motherboard and they will work fine but you may not get the speed / throughput you want, other times they will fail sooner than later.

Asus has some pretty decent motherboards and have been around for a long time - I would highly recommend them - and they have very good quality. Gigabyte is sort of a low - mid range brand along with a few others.

Cheers! :thumbsup:



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PostPosted: Wed Jun 16, 2010 6:06 pm 
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One thing that I cannot stress enough is to make sure you have a matched system. By this I mean that the motherboard not only is the right one for the CPU but that the memory speeds are correct for the memory that you intend to use. Also, if you are planning on using more than 3 GB of memory, your operating system must be 64 bit to make full use of the ram.

On the note of ram, they are now selling triple channel ram that comes in a three dimm or stick kit. If you are buying 6 GB of ram, make sure it is the proper channel type and that the motherboard supports that channel type.

Too many times I have seen computers for sale that boast a good motherboard with say 1800 Mhz memory speeds being sold with 1200 Mhz memory. Likewise advertising 6 GB of memory with a 32 bit operating system. 32 bit operating systems only recognize less than 4 GB.



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PostPosted: Fri Jun 18, 2010 1:09 am 
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core i's don't have a fsb anymore. So you won't see that speed.

kijiji is your friend



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PostPosted: Fri Jun 18, 2010 1:32 pm 
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Actually, I made no mention of FSB in my post and you will see those speeds in your memory. If your motherboard is designed to take 2000 Mhz ram and you change out your 2000 Mhz ram for 1333 Mhz ram, you will see a definite drop in performance.

The point I am trying to make is that your system will only run as fast as your slowest component.



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PostPosted: Sun Jun 20, 2010 12:34 am 
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Don CVA1279 wrote:
Rob, I'm sure Robert will have some great pointers about what a good system for FSX entails. I think the author of the article that Frank pointed to at the beginning of this thread also dealt with the hardware needs of FSX and it truly is CPU hungry. I think the author mentioned that a cpu speed of at least 3.0MHZ is what you need. Don't know if you have looked at the Jetline systems site(Jetlinesystems.com). They build systems just for FSX and other games. They aren't cheap but you will see what they build into an FSX system and why they select the hardware they do.
I have a 2.66MHZ system here in Ottawa and a 3.0MHZ system at my winter abode in Arizona. I find there's a big difference between the two system in terms of FSX and just about everything else too!

Happy shopping!

Guys - just want to point out that I was very tempted to deal with jetlinersystems as suggested by Don, but when I saw they were using GigaByte mobos and other cheaper parts, I decided to find something used but good quality for less money. I got a dual core 3.16GHz on a brand name mobo in a brand name case. Even came with a cooler. It didn't come OC'd but it does have a ton of instructions and sofware to help do that.

No disrespect to Don, but just something to keep in mind if you go for packages. I have/had a dell and am tired of not being able to work on anything.




Edited By Rob Vanderkam on 1276994162



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