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PostPosted: Fri Jun 17, 2005 7:12 pm 
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Location: Brockville, ON
Hey Gang,

I'm looking for some help from one of the "Mentor's" out there if anyone is around this Saturday? I'd like to do a few short flights to practice manual approach procedures. Generally I can get out of the airports ok and takeoff, then autopilot. However, as I am coming into the airports for landing on manual I have a #### of a time.

I find myself having problems with altitude stability and controlling the aircraft on approach and it's frustrating. I think part of the problem may be my flight yoke but not sure - more likely just me :D As well, could use some help on some of the SID / STAR chart readings to help understand.

Any takers to give this poor Mook a hand? :D :D

If not, I will have some time the week of June 27th as well.

Thanks!

Darryl
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 17, 2005 7:57 pm 
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Joined: Fri Dec 29, 2000 7:37 pm
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Location: North Vancouver
I used to have problems landing years back when I was filling the gas tank to full. Since monitoring the amount of fuel needed for a flight my landing sucess rate is a way up.
Dale(CVA1050)



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PostPosted: Fri Jun 17, 2005 8:09 pm 
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Hey Dale!

Thanks for the reply and I'll give that a shot!

Darryl
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 17, 2005 11:11 pm 
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Location: Prince George, B.C.
ME Too......Weight I have learn't is a very BIG Deal when triing to Land. Just about tear the flaps off mantaining enough airspeed for stability, and don't FALL out of the SKY on approach if the airspeed get a little low.



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PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2005 6:08 pm 
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Ok, so I didn't have any takes to help train me...

So...putting out the same request for a night this week? Anyone have time to give me some pointers???

Thanks!



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PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2005 6:14 pm 
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it mis 15:15 right now here in CYSj can you go O/line right now in CYSJ and if you can use a dash -8 or smaller i will sit there for a hour ., i will try to help . if you can i will try to be o/line tonight in CYHZ and help yopu out . . see you there .lol Terry CVA44T



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PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2005 8:36 pm 
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LOL :D

Thanks for the reply Terry! Tonight is a no go (at least for the middle part of my evening). I'm receiving training tonight on ATC from VATCAN! I figured if I can't pilot a plane that well I may as well try and direct a few in the air instead. hopefully I have better luck at ATC :D

I'll see if I can find you online tonight once I'm done. If I see ya that'd be great. If not, I appreciate the offer and can try and hook up another night this week.

Ciao!



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PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2005 8:53 pm 
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if you want a mentor, Darryl - you should post a request in the Helpline forum.

I don't check this forum for things like that...



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PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2005 9:11 pm 
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Darryl, I don't know if you have tried flying just using trim, and throttle for rate of climb or decent. Tough to get used to but it works. I'm no real life pilot, but for the rides I've been in the front seat I remember the yoke was mostly used for quick corrections due to tubulance and turns, other then that I saw trim and throttle action going during the flight. :O ???



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PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2005 10:00 pm 
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Very true, James.

In any aircraft (that I've ever flown in) during the climb/descent phase of flight, Pitch controls airspeed, Power controls vertical velocity.

Going too fast on final? Pull the stick back. This raises the nose and slows the aircraft. It will also start to "level off" or climb so you must retard the throttles to get her sinking again. Once established on speed and glide slope, trim the elevators to take the pressure off the yoke (and your arms). NO PILOT SHOULD MAKE PITCH CORRECTIONS WITH TRIM ALONE.

Here's an example you can try.

Cessna 172 on final. Speed at around 70 kias. You notice that you're going to land short of the runway (in other words, you're descending too fast).

What happens if you yank the stick back to slow your descent without adjusting power?

Have fun.



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PostPosted: Tue Jun 28, 2005 1:39 am 
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Ummmm...................hmmmm..................let me think..........................STALL ???

I agree Keith, and I don't just fly with the trim as I think you have seen first hand, but it makes for good practice on using the trim, and getting it set right.



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PostPosted: Tue Jun 28, 2005 2:16 am 
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Hey Guys,

All good points and yup, I've tried to fly with the trim / throttle as James describes. I think my problem is the trim / throttle adjustment. I don't seem to get the effects and so I end up to fast / slow in my decent, going from one extreme to the next. I need to find a better way to do the adjustments and not have the radical changes.

Devon - thanks for the heads up although I thought this was the appropriate forum. My apologies.

Ciao!



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PostPosted: Tue Jun 28, 2005 4:20 am 
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Is it maybe the aircraft you are flying, or another thing to try is adjust your flaps to create the right amount of drag for a particular throttle setting and airspeed. I found this can help alot in aircraft stability, also I find I sometimes have to barely apply pressure to the throttle to make an adjustment.



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PostPosted: Tue Jun 28, 2005 5:41 am 
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Trim for airspeed, throttle for altitude.

When you are on final, get your aircraft set up for the approach configuration you want, but address your speed first. If your aircraft needs to approach at, I dunno, say 80 knots, stabilize to 80 knots first. Now hold that speed no matter what else you do. If you are too high, add flaps; if you are too low, bring up the nose and add power while maintaining your 80 knots. If you are out of flaps, chop the power...maintain 80 knots by adjusting pitch down. If you have full flaps, have chopped power, are still doing 80 knots and are still too high, well...you blew you it! Go around and try again!

Once again this is way oversimplified, but should still work.



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PostPosted: Tue Jun 28, 2005 5:56 am 
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A couple of points here, Darryl.

A real pilot in the real world would have the POH (Pilot's Operating Handbook) for the aircraft he is flying. Contained in this wealth of information would be recommended settings for climb, cruise and descents. Knowing where to start and then "fine-tunining" the controls is half the battle.

In simulator land, we rarely have this, although you can sometimes find information of this nature by searching the web. My recommendation is to practice... Lots... with the aircraft you're having trouble with. Find out where it stalls. Clean and dirty. If you know the plane will stall at 90 kias with full flaps and the gear out, make your approach at 110 kias and try that. Watch your fuel load too. Weight makes a difference. While learning, try to keep your fuel load under 25%.

Another point. There is a big difference between a piston engine and a jet engine. With a piston, the power comes on and off relatively quick. Jet engines (be they turboprops or turbojets) are much slower at "spooling up" and down when reacting to throttle input. Make your power changes small and smooth and let the plane settle at the new setting before making a large correction the other way. Example, if you're too high, pull just a bit of power off and wait to see what the plane does. You need to give it time to react to your inputs.

James is right, controllers tend to be very touchy with FS, especially the throttles. Watch your manifold pressure or N1 readings and make power changes based on that.

Hope it helps.



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